<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><!-- generator="wordpress/2.3.2" -->
<rss version="2.0"
	xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/"
	xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"
	>
<channel>
	<title>Comments on: Medical Students v 2.0</title>
	<link>http://www.medschoolhell.com/2007/12/13/medical-students-v-20/</link>
	<description>A Cynical Look At Medical School and Medical Training</description>
	<pubDate>Mon, 01 Dec 2008 21:11:48 +0000</pubDate>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=2.3.2</generator>
		<item>
		<title>By: Med School Hell &#187; Generational Differences and Medical Training</title>
		<link>http://www.medschoolhell.com/2007/12/13/medical-students-v-20/#comment-25801</link>
		<dc:creator>Med School Hell &#187; Generational Differences and Medical Training</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 26 Sep 2008 00:44:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.medschoolhell.com/2007/12/13/medical-students-v-20/#comment-25801</guid>
		<description>[...] someone who goes by the name of &#8220;Deaner.&#8221; He or she was responding to my post entitled Medical Students v 2.0. That post is very old, so I wanted to repost it here so that it will get some views. He or she [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[&#8230;] someone who goes by the name of &#8220;Deaner.&#8221; He or she was responding to my post entitled Medical Students v 2.0. That post is very old, so I wanted to repost it here so that it will get some views. He or she [&#8230;]</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Hoover</title>
		<link>http://www.medschoolhell.com/2007/12/13/medical-students-v-20/#comment-25800</link>
		<dc:creator>Hoover</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 26 Sep 2008 00:35:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.medschoolhell.com/2007/12/13/medical-students-v-20/#comment-25800</guid>
		<description>Wow, solid comment. It might not get many views way down here, so I'm posting it up as a new post.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wow, solid comment. It might not get many views way down here, so I&#8217;m posting it up as a new post.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Deaner</title>
		<link>http://www.medschoolhell.com/2007/12/13/medical-students-v-20/#comment-25713</link>
		<dc:creator>Deaner</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Sep 2008 16:41:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.medschoolhell.com/2007/12/13/medical-students-v-20/#comment-25713</guid>
		<description>I was recently describing the generational difference to a group of friends.  Generation X and Y.  Its not that we are "entitled, lazy, arrogant or non-caring."  It isn't even that we leave in the midst of patient care and never would we refuse to be involved in an opportunity for education-- as the physician above implied.  This is a misinterpretation by an older generation that comes from their lack of regard to our goals, our mission and our acute understanding of our surroundings. 

Looking at the physicians that make up today's medical field, we are able to deduce the effect that traditional medical education has on its participants.  We the older generation of physicians who are bitter, overworked, validation (read: money)-hungry doctors many of whom practice medicine without respect to the patient and without love for their work. We (generation X and Y) on the other hand, are committed to our own sanity, health and future. We want to be good doctors. Period. So when we see inefficiency and ineffectiveness in medical education, which leads to suffering and sacrificing of health, we want to fix it. We recognize that it takes not just one, but two elements to allows us care of patients in our fullest capacity:

1. Rigorous and extensive education. 
2. Our own mental and physical health and continued enthusiasm towards patient care and medicine.  

So we put our heads together to change what could be better.  Cut out anything that is either impinging on one of the stated elements without fulfilling the other.  Why? So we have more free time to play? No.  Because we think we are too good for traditional methods? No. Because we think we've somehow earned it? No. Because we don't care about medicine?  Absolutely not.  We want to fix it because we want to be good doctors. We want to learn every second that we are not working to stay healthy (sleeping, eating, feeling.) We know that we must stay positive (not resent the hospital or our patients) in order to open our minds to allow the maximal amount of education to enable us to be both wise and compassionate doctors. 

We refuse to have our potential to be great and healthy physicians stripped from us by our experience with medical education. 

I am not bothered by older doctors saying "blah, blah, we worked so much harder than you..." Instead, I pity them.  I pity them for justifying their misery but ridiculing our commitment to change.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I was recently describing the generational difference to a group of friends.  Generation X and Y.  Its not that we are &#8220;entitled, lazy, arrogant or non-caring.&#8221;  It isn&#8217;t even that we leave in the midst of patient care and never would we refuse to be involved in an opportunity for education&#8211; as the physician above implied.  This is a misinterpretation by an older generation that comes from their lack of regard to our goals, our mission and our acute understanding of our surroundings. </p>
<p>Looking at the physicians that make up today&#8217;s medical field, we are able to deduce the effect that traditional medical education has on its participants.  We the older generation of physicians who are bitter, overworked, validation (read: money)-hungry doctors many of whom practice medicine without respect to the patient and without love for their work. We (generation X and Y) on the other hand, are committed to our own sanity, health and future. We want to be good doctors. Period. So when we see inefficiency and ineffectiveness in medical education, which leads to suffering and sacrificing of health, we want to fix it. We recognize that it takes not just one, but two elements to allows us care of patients in our fullest capacity:</p>
<p>1. Rigorous and extensive education.<br />
2. Our own mental and physical health and continued enthusiasm towards patient care and medicine.  </p>
<p>So we put our heads together to change what could be better.  Cut out anything that is either impinging on one of the stated elements without fulfilling the other.  Why? So we have more free time to play? No.  Because we think we are too good for traditional methods? No. Because we think we&#8217;ve somehow earned it? No. Because we don&#8217;t care about medicine?  Absolutely not.  We want to fix it because we want to be good doctors. We want to learn every second that we are not working to stay healthy (sleeping, eating, feeling.) We know that we must stay positive (not resent the hospital or our patients) in order to open our minds to allow the maximal amount of education to enable us to be both wise and compassionate doctors. </p>
<p>We refuse to have our potential to be great and healthy physicians stripped from us by our experience with medical education. </p>
<p>I am not bothered by older doctors saying &#8220;blah, blah, we worked so much harder than you&#8230;&#8221; Instead, I pity them.  I pity them for justifying their misery but ridiculing our commitment to change.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Someonect</title>
		<link>http://www.medschoolhell.com/2007/12/13/medical-students-v-20/#comment-11372</link>
		<dc:creator>Someonect</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 22 Dec 2007 22:58:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.medschoolhell.com/2007/12/13/medical-students-v-20/#comment-11372</guid>
		<description>ah yes, generation y ... the slackers.  or was that generation x .... the slackers. or may be the baby boomers.  well it really doesn't matter, the older generation always views the younger generation as "slackers".  are medical students slackers?  well in my view they didn't work as hard as i did.  but, you know that was my perspective.  in truth, they probably work just as hard.  i can say they are more likely to refuse to do something.  

on my site i have posted a number of times on the generational issue.  It is something i have looked at and tried to understand.  many of the younger generation speak about the inefficiencies in medical education.  i would agree that many inefficiencies exist.  many of the younger generation say that they could make the system more efficient.  but, they have yet to come forth with alternatives.

we typically concentrate on things that frustrate us, such as,  scut work, long meaningless lectures, and holding "hook".  students concentrate on the learn testable material for the shelf exams, and boards. the problem is that i have never met a test that as treated a patient. if one is going to treat patients, one must treat patients.  watching clinical examination and patient-physician interactions is extremely important for those going into clinical specialties.  understanding the nuances of a patient's body language or ways of asking questions to elicit the proper answers can not be read.  most of these techniques can be read about but the application must be observed.

the reason that many of the "new generation" is seen as “arrogant, entitled, lazy, and non-caring” is because they are more likely to leave early to work out than console a crying mother.  when asked to help with a case that is uninteresting, they refuse; but when an interesting case appears, they want to do the procedure.  yet as the attending surgeon, none of these cases are beneath me.

i enjoy teaching medical students.  i am known for stealing a medical student from the 5 on general surgery, and making them do a case (i mean actually do a case. sew, reduce a fracture, or drain the abscess, etc.)  when i evaluate a medical student, i look for someone that i would want to be a physician for my family.  as a medical student, they should want to be that kind of physician.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>ah yes, generation y &#8230; the slackers.  or was that generation x &#8230;. the slackers. or may be the baby boomers.  well it really doesn&#8217;t matter, the older generation always views the younger generation as &#8220;slackers&#8221;.  are medical students slackers?  well in my view they didn&#8217;t work as hard as i did.  but, you know that was my perspective.  in truth, they probably work just as hard.  i can say they are more likely to refuse to do something.  </p>
<p>on my site i have posted a number of times on the generational issue.  It is something i have looked at and tried to understand.  many of the younger generation speak about the inefficiencies in medical education.  i would agree that many inefficiencies exist.  many of the younger generation say that they could make the system more efficient.  but, they have yet to come forth with alternatives.</p>
<p>we typically concentrate on things that frustrate us, such as,  scut work, long meaningless lectures, and holding &#8220;hook&#8221;.  students concentrate on the learn testable material for the shelf exams, and boards. the problem is that i have never met a test that as treated a patient. if one is going to treat patients, one must treat patients.  watching clinical examination and patient-physician interactions is extremely important for those going into clinical specialties.  understanding the nuances of a patient&#8217;s body language or ways of asking questions to elicit the proper answers can not be read.  most of these techniques can be read about but the application must be observed.</p>
<p>the reason that many of the &#8220;new generation&#8221; is seen as “arrogant, entitled, lazy, and non-caring” is because they are more likely to leave early to work out than console a crying mother.  when asked to help with a case that is uninteresting, they refuse; but when an interesting case appears, they want to do the procedure.  yet as the attending surgeon, none of these cases are beneath me.</p>
<p>i enjoy teaching medical students.  i am known for stealing a medical student from the 5 on general surgery, and making them do a case (i mean actually do a case. sew, reduce a fracture, or drain the abscess, etc.)  when i evaluate a medical student, i look for someone that i would want to be a physician for my family.  as a medical student, they should want to be that kind of physician.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: p</title>
		<link>http://www.medschoolhell.com/2007/12/13/medical-students-v-20/#comment-10686</link>
		<dc:creator>p</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 15 Dec 2007 20:48:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.medschoolhell.com/2007/12/13/medical-students-v-20/#comment-10686</guid>
		<description>I think that there is SOME truth to what you're saying. 

Currently I am on my [horrid] surgery rotation, and there are 4 students with me. From day 1, we all secretly agreed that not one of us would come in on Saturday, and no one has ever asked us about it. I already work an easy 60 hours a week not including call, so I'd like to use my weekends for something other than writing notes.

(Although at the hospital I am at, they aren't even allowed to just use our notes, they have to write a lot of their own stuff down, so now I just go there for show.)

However, my other take on it is that every older generation complains how the current one is going downhill, yet we always manage to not destroy human existence. 

And I have to agree with the person above....I am part of a rep council at my school, and the complaints I'm bring up as an MS3, I heard as an MS1. Nothing changes in med school. There is so much red tape, no one cares and we're just labeled as "whiners" (which really did happen to my class).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think that there is SOME truth to what you&#8217;re saying. </p>
<p>Currently I am on my [horrid] surgery rotation, and there are 4 students with me. From day 1, we all secretly agreed that not one of us would come in on Saturday, and no one has ever asked us about it. I already work an easy 60 hours a week not including call, so I&#8217;d like to use my weekends for something other than writing notes.</p>
<p>(Although at the hospital I am at, they aren&#8217;t even allowed to just use our notes, they have to write a lot of their own stuff down, so now I just go there for show.)</p>
<p>However, my other take on it is that every older generation complains how the current one is going downhill, yet we always manage to not destroy human existence. </p>
<p>And I have to agree with the person above&#8230;.I am part of a rep council at my school, and the complaints I&#8217;m bring up as an MS3, I heard as an MS1. Nothing changes in med school. There is so much red tape, no one cares and we&#8217;re just labeled as &#8220;whiners&#8221; (which really did happen to my class).</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
</channel>
</rss>

<!-- Dynamic Page Served (once) in 0.460 seconds -->
